tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post2125972473966256985..comments2024-02-25T05:23:15.261-05:00Comments on food for thought | a miami food blog: Cracking the CodesFrodnesorhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-43257227871618998002009-05-18T19:21:00.000-04:002009-05-18T19:21:00.000-04:00You see I don't think you have addressed the issue...You see I don't think you have addressed the issue of ethics. A code of ethics is something that is widely adopted by people who practice a profession. They adopt the code to guarantee the public that they will be treated ethically, and to insolate themselves from members of their profession who act in an unethical manner. The issue that you raise about bloggers and discussion forum posters is Steve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-7913839974314705602009-05-18T15:00:00.000-04:002009-05-18T15:00:00.000-04:00I agree with questioning the need for a code in th...I agree with questioning the need for a code in the first place. Blogs are not primarily intended to be sites where people come once for a specific piece of information then never return. The vast majority are intended as components of a vast online community, in which people visit repeatedly and get to know a blog and how it operates over time. Those of us who are into blogging become attracted docsconzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05619086289498908467noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-9291178491348026672009-05-18T14:40:00.000-04:002009-05-18T14:40:00.000-04:00For some reason my last response to Doc' hasn't ap...For some reason my last response to Doc' hasn't appeared so let me respost it. The reason the qualifications, stature and ethics of the people who proposed these codes comes into question is because no one has been able to make a case for why there needs to be a code, other than supposition that it would be a good thing. So since the issue can't be settled based on real life examples of unethicalSteve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-37256640650550751922009-05-18T09:54:00.000-04:002009-05-18T09:54:00.000-04:00Steve, what difference does it make who is proposi...Steve, what difference does it make who is proposing anything? I don't really care if something is self-aggrandizing or not, if what is said makes sense and is good. To decry a proposal not on its merits but simply because of the perceived qualifications or reasons of those who proposed it is an ad hominem attack. Either the proposal makes sense and is good or it doesn't. These codes are by no docsconzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05619086289498908467noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-39497189686318186102009-05-18T09:06:00.000-04:002009-05-18T09:06:00.000-04:00I forgot to rewspond to this point made by Frod:
...I forgot to rewspond to this point made by Frod:<br /><br />"Couldn't the same charge be leveled against just about anything someone posts on the web?" <br /><br />The difference is that the average person who posts on the 'Net isn't trying to control the behavior of other bloggers. That's where the self-aggrabdizement comes in.Steve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-84345879925908914062009-05-18T08:56:00.000-04:002009-05-18T08:56:00.000-04:00"I'm not sure how you ever respond to a charge tha..."I'm not sure how you ever respond to a charge that someone is "trying to aggrandize their own position in the overall conversation on the 'Net for their own benefit"." <br /><br />Well on what basis are these two women qualified to be the arbiters of who is ethical and who isn't? And I ask that question both from the perspective of qualification and stature. I mean why have they decided that Steve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-30090422189557658982009-05-17T15:48:00.000-04:002009-05-17T15:48:00.000-04:00In followup to SaltShaker's comment, the authors' ...In followup to SaltShaker's comment, the authors' respective websites both say they are working on a "culinary guidebook". I'm not looking to defend them, but I've not seen anywhere else that they're writing a book on food blogging (though they might now!).<br /><br />But more generally, I'm not sure how you ever respond to a charge that someone is "trying to aggrandize their own position in the Frodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-40510675504124383722009-05-17T13:05:00.000-04:002009-05-17T13:05:00.000-04:00"Can someone tell me if there is a reason for a bl..."Can someone tell me if there is a reason for a blogger code of ethics? Did something bad happen or is this just another example of certain people trying to aggrandize their own position in the overall conversation on the 'Net for their own benefit?"<br />Is Plotnicki correct here?Danny Brodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02538875863110231038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-78267011465422201922009-05-16T23:24:00.000-04:002009-05-16T23:24:00.000-04:00In terms of a precipitating event... I'm sure it c...In terms of a precipitating event... I'm sure it couldn't be that the two young ladies who proposed the code that started all this nonsense just happen to be about to publish a book on food blogging... it's just a coincidence.SaltShakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08618712027169382550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-3459004382140900862009-05-16T22:29:00.000-04:002009-05-16T22:29:00.000-04:00Here's another alternative Food Blogger Code of Et...Here's another alternative <A HREF="http://foodbloggercodeofethics.blogspot.com/" REL="nofollow">Food Blogger Code of Ethics</A>.Frodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-77092606997727070172009-05-15T18:04:00.000-04:002009-05-15T18:04:00.000-04:00The problem with a badge is that if it becomes wid...The problem with a badge is that if it becomes widely accepted, it taints blogs that don't have it. For example, OA's goal is for me to get the best meal possible so I can communicate that info to readers. And while I always disclose what is going on, some people say trying to get special treatment is unethical behavior. What will happen if the badge catches on, and because of the above, the Steve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-37996595253929231532009-05-15T13:50:00.000-04:002009-05-15T13:50:00.000-04:00Nice discussion. I'm not sure that a code is neces...Nice discussion. I'm not sure that a code is necessary, but I think that it helps for people coming to a blog for the first time to have a sense of what that blogger's values are and where that blogger is coming from. Someone who has a bias or is a shill will become obvious over time if not initially. The first time visitor won't necessarily be able to glean anything with certainty just by the docsconzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05619086289498908467noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-66975549730705879092009-05-14T09:10:00.000-04:002009-05-14T09:10:00.000-04:00eGullet has now released (in "final") its code: eG...eGullet has now released (in "final") its code: <A HREF="http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=124044/" REL="nofollow">eGullet ethics code</A>.Frodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-68418941691398136622009-05-13T17:31:00.000-04:002009-05-13T17:31:00.000-04:00Thank you Frod. So I guess we are back to no rule...Thank you Frod. So I guess we are back to no rules. Oh wait, I left one out...try to be entertaining. Thanks for reminding me, Plotnicki. Although I agree with Steve that this 'code' thing just seems to come up every now and then for no particular reason. I also feel that much of this has been covered ad nauseum, especially on the much-esteemed PressChops. Self-aggrandizement aside.<br />AsDanny Brodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02538875863110231038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-45952332964354292622009-05-13T11:02:00.000-04:002009-05-13T11:02:00.000-04:00Here is what I just posted on a different discussi...Here is what I just posted on a different discussion forum about this topic. Bloggers have an advantage over the mainstream media, specifically because we don't have the burden of complying with these types of codes. As a result,the information that we offer is often much more relevant and insightful than what the mainstream media reports. In reality, the proposed codes are intended to limit the Steve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-63191456324117788092009-05-13T09:28:00.000-04:002009-05-13T09:28:00.000-04:00Steve - I don't think there was any particular pre...Steve - I don't think there was any particular precipitating event. The first initiative came from a couple food bloggers who I'd never heard of (no slam against them - I'm sure they haven't heard of me either!), but seems pretty earnest and well-intentioned. It has gotten a lot of media attention and the authors don't seem to have used it to try to capitalize on other ventures.<br /><br />But Frodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-42774543317394377702009-05-13T08:45:00.000-04:002009-05-13T08:45:00.000-04:00Can someone tell me if there is a reason for a blo...Can someone tell me if there is a reason for a blogger code of ethics? Did something bad happen or is this just another example of certain people trying to aggrandize their own position in the overall conversation on the 'Net for their own benefit?Steve Plotnickihttp://www.opinionatedaboutdining.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-90390137576516041912009-05-12T17:44:00.000-04:002009-05-12T17:44:00.000-04:00these "codes" are really just reminders for non-pr...these "codes" are really just reminders for non-professionals and non-journalists, since so many "amateur" bloggers are getting in on the reviewing act. As you say guidelines are covered thoroughly by the Association of Food Journalists; the current buzz doesn't cover much new territory. Nobody's gonna police this; it's merely a reminder to be ethical. Bad reviews can cost people their gail shepherdnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-50702440013495780472009-05-12T15:02:00.000-04:002009-05-12T15:02:00.000-04:00Danny - you're granted special dispensation from m...Danny - you're granted special dispensation from my Rule #2.Frodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-47292161610283886912009-05-12T13:38:00.000-04:002009-05-12T13:38:00.000-04:00An ad hominem post would mean that I was using Sha...An ad hominem post would mean that I was using Shaw's alleged behavior as an argument against there being a code of ethics. I haven't come out against a code although I believe that is how I am going to come down once I think it through.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-88928095059084835062009-05-12T12:46:00.000-04:002009-05-12T12:46:00.000-04:00"Be honest.
Don't be a douche."
Unfortunately, the..."Be honest.<br />Don't be a douche."<br />Unfortunately, the first is completely subjective, and the second is actually how I define myself. Hmmm.<br /><br />The first and only rule I have is to be a good writer, and that goes for (unpaid) blogging as well as for actual paid pieces. Everything else will follow. <br /><br />Douche.Danny Brodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02538875863110231038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-36468916949009199622009-05-12T10:29:00.000-04:002009-05-12T10:29:00.000-04:00Drama on the Internets? Never!
I'm glad you offe...Drama on the Internets? Never! <br /><br />I'm glad you offered an amendment to the idea of visiting more than once. In a perfect world, I would visit a restaurant as many times as it takes to feel confident in my impression of their business. It's hard to put a number on that; is two enough? Sometimes, no. Regardless, even in traditional media we don't always have the budget to visit multiple johnmlinnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13502271719049827697noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-64468975773529554772009-05-12T09:29:00.000-04:002009-05-12T09:29:00.000-04:00Well, that's exactly why I described your post as ...Well, that's exactly why I described your post as "ad hominem." I would be interested in your thoughts on the whole "code" idea. I think there's some good aspirational goals in there, but I'm not sure I see the point of a "code" or a "badge". One fundamental problem is that there's no teeth - who is going to police it? Ultimately it's all self-regulating, which is exactly where we are now.<br /><Frodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-36875691743416098732009-05-12T08:11:00.000-04:002009-05-12T08:11:00.000-04:00My post isn't about whether a code is a good idea ...My post isn't about whether a code is a good idea or not, it's about Steven Shaw not being in a position to be the one to propose a code because of what look like a series of significant ethical lapses in the past. I haven't thought about "the code" yet, but my initial instinct is to say that it isn't needed. I am going to compose a blog article about the merits at some point.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03400073779489420071noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8360180337648262818.post-26256789224386413182009-05-12T01:13:00.000-04:002009-05-12T01:13:00.000-04:00I doubt it, I suspect you're a pretty thick-skinne...I doubt it, I suspect you're a pretty thick-skinned type. *) It may all very well be true - and if so, it's pretty disappointing to hear, though I've never been very deep into eGullet anyway (the Florida board is moribund) - but I didn't really see that your post did much to advance the ball on whether "codes" are a good thing and if so what they ought to be, which is what I've been interested inFrodnesorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03830756373260010912noreply@blogger.com